Sweet post, as usual! I would only say that at times, it seems that when you say you're looking for a tribe it sounds like you mean community. In the US that word has been abused, in part because it has been substituted for "tribe" as a PC version of it by the media. "The Black community" sounds much better than "the Black tribe," even though Black people have many communities across the country.
Speaking for myself, I've reclaimed a lot of my good old tribal heritage and it's been the right choice. I'm a foreign cultures guy, and understanding other cultures makes no sense when you don't understand your own. But I could live in my country of origin, live all by myself and not know anybody: I'd still be part of the tribe. In terms of community, that requires people in a more immediate sense. And in that sense, the only community I've found is the Roman Catholic Church.
While liberalism has done a lot of good, I don't think the solution to 18th-century tribalism was to abandon it wholesale. Especially as religion was the greater umbrella, and Christianity was not exclusive to single countries; in that sense, not all tribes are the same. Rather, it was better to expand it or to accept our multitudes, to quote Whitman: a part of liberalism's appeal was that only it was able to replace the cosmopolitan character of Catholicism, even if it couldn't replace the strong cultural appreciation within the flock; nationalism could not. Now it can. Somebody might be a total patriot, but if they are a carpenter that won't stop them from formulating a professional kinship with carpenters from other countries. Sure, we might want "our" carpenter to "win." But actually, I think it's good for countries to have that kind of rivalry. If they didn't feel that allegiance, Western countries would brain drain them: hell, they already have. If the choice is for every country to have a few great carpenters and be proud of them or for coastal American cities to take all the carpenters from everywhere else, I choose the former all the way. (Perhaps there's a more applicable profession, but carpenters came to my head first :P )
I gotta say though: I enjoy being in the writer's tribe. A lot of interesting people for sure! Even so, it is a multitude: one of many. And as Whitman wrote, contradiction is fine. Perhaps the mistake all along has been to try and define ourselves through only one element of ourselves. My reading of Steppenwolf saw his journey as a balancing act of this sort.
Felix, you're definitely a-speaking my language with all the Whitman discussion! Yeah, I agree with a lot of that. I think the underlying "tribe" is to accept "multitudes" and "contradictions" - that's the badge of being part of the "writers' tribe," which can extend perfectly well to people who don't explicitly write.
I definitely grew up with an ingrained idea of ever-expanding liberalism gradually obliterating national borders - the vision of the UN. The last few years have definitely jaded me on that perspective (I have a feeling that you had a stronger sense of national identity in growing up). I'm now pretty sure that I don't want to be part of some supra-national system that slashes prices and wages everywhere it goes, that imposes things like arbitrary lockdowns, and then oh-so-gently quells all critique of itself. The last few years have made me much more appreciative for 'nationalism' of the 19th century liberal variety, with emphasis on difference, self-determination, the ability of many different cultures and vantage-points to flourish all at once. - Sam
Sam, I suspect our age is similar and wile the details differ, I feel your sense of untethered dislocation. Unlike Felix, I left religion after college and haven’t looked back. I dig spirituality and ancient texts but I get your discomfort with the more woo aspects, and after having been devout, I’m in no rush commit too deeply to any particular creed or practice. And I totally grok the myriad of the characters you’ve met in your journey. As I enter the back half of my career, I find that identifying with my profession thin gruel with an impending expiration date. And then pandemic (especially given my wife’s hyper cautiousness) has killed any chance of developing bonds with parents in my kids cohorts.
I always assumed it was just a matter of being a child of immigrants and marrying an immigrant, but now I wonder if it’s also a function of coming of age in the late 90’s during an era of American hegemony, albeit tarnished with our overtly imperialistic peccadillos in the 00’s.
Hey Justus, a lot to think about in what you're writing. I like the verb "grok" btw! - haven't heard that before. Yeah, "identifying with a profession" has been a challenging idea in my life. I'm not sure that the "adversarial system" of the American professional-managerial class works for me - the idea that you identify strongly with your company, or your brand or whatever, and then dedicate your career to a sort of mock-warfare with competitors who are in the same line of work as you. I get why it's an effective system but it just doesn't exactly work for me for some different psychological reasons. I'd be curious to hear more about how you think your perspective was shaped by America in the '90s. Thinking about it in those terms, I think that for me that era created a sense of utopianism - that we had solved some of the underlying problems of societal violence, political organization, and economic stability and that that would give us the platform to build the society of our dreams - and there's been an acute disillusionment that that hasn't exactly materialized. I don't know if there was any real basis to that idealism - it may have just been that our happy memories of childhood coincided with an unusually optimistic period, with the millennium approaching and with an interregnum in great-power rivalries - but I do think there was something poignant in that worldview (and it definitely sets us apart from the Gen Zs who see doom everywhere they go). Anyway, all interesting things to think about!
I was a conservative in the 90's (before become liberal in the 00's after watching Bush screw up Iraq and Katrina) so I've been haunted with a sense of national decline my entire adult life....but even so, coming of age as a middle-class citizen in a unipolar empire must affect one's view of the world. I don't think I fully bought into the Reagan optimism, but still, there's a reason I fell hard for Obama (and felt Tim Scott pulling those heart strings too...too bad he doesn't have the cojones to take on Trump directly).
We also got to see the rise of information technology first hand. From four clunky Apple IIe's in first grade (learning to type on laminated sheets of papers) to having computers in our pockets by the time we finished grad school. If that doesn't breed technological optimism, I dunno what would. Of course the 00's and '10s turned out to be an algorithmically fueled social media tragedy.....
Unlike Z's, my big difference in my outlook of the world is knowing that all the alternatives sucks harder. It's one thing to read about Communist atrocities, it's a whole other thing to go with kids whose parents escaped Vietnam (and my grandmother from a relatively wealthy family got out from Mao's china by the skin of her teeth with her four kids).
The current appeal of Maoism on the left and Fascism on the right completely mystifies me – yeah I'd love to have my opinions enacted on the rest of the nation...but the costs are too damn high. Of course, the older folks that watch Fox all day should know better (at least the Z's have the excuse of youth)...but goes to show that propaganda f'ing works.
I'll add this here b/c as a fellow tribe member we might as well spread the tribal conversation to both corners:
Thoughtful as always. I’ve been using the term “tribe” for years to speak of my community that exists across so many different boarders. Most of them are creatively driven, even if that means they have a day job, i.e. almost always. But more recently, as I enter my mid 30s, I’ve noticed the disparity between what I’ve come to see as a more traditional/American form of ambition that’s usually related to material wealth and/or public recognition (which is really just another word for high school grade popularity), and people, my tribe, who are more interested in figuring out how to feel fulfilled without any external validation. Thanks for inspiring these many thoughts.
Thank you Samuél! That's all a really nice way to put it. One way I've been thinking about this is that the entire time I was in middle school/high school, I was waiting for people to 'grow up' - for some standard of worth to exist that wasn't the equivalent of high school popularity - and it's been a real disappointment in my life that adulthood doesn't provide that. I don't think it's that it doesn't exist; just that the way our culture is arrayed we're in a sort of eternal high school. So, yes, it's really nice to be part of a tribe - even if an outnumbered and frequently-demoralized tribe! - that just feels there needs to be some other standard of worth; some journey towards a real maturity. Happy to be part of that tribe with you! - Sam
Sweet post, as usual! I would only say that at times, it seems that when you say you're looking for a tribe it sounds like you mean community. In the US that word has been abused, in part because it has been substituted for "tribe" as a PC version of it by the media. "The Black community" sounds much better than "the Black tribe," even though Black people have many communities across the country.
Speaking for myself, I've reclaimed a lot of my good old tribal heritage and it's been the right choice. I'm a foreign cultures guy, and understanding other cultures makes no sense when you don't understand your own. But I could live in my country of origin, live all by myself and not know anybody: I'd still be part of the tribe. In terms of community, that requires people in a more immediate sense. And in that sense, the only community I've found is the Roman Catholic Church.
While liberalism has done a lot of good, I don't think the solution to 18th-century tribalism was to abandon it wholesale. Especially as religion was the greater umbrella, and Christianity was not exclusive to single countries; in that sense, not all tribes are the same. Rather, it was better to expand it or to accept our multitudes, to quote Whitman: a part of liberalism's appeal was that only it was able to replace the cosmopolitan character of Catholicism, even if it couldn't replace the strong cultural appreciation within the flock; nationalism could not. Now it can. Somebody might be a total patriot, but if they are a carpenter that won't stop them from formulating a professional kinship with carpenters from other countries. Sure, we might want "our" carpenter to "win." But actually, I think it's good for countries to have that kind of rivalry. If they didn't feel that allegiance, Western countries would brain drain them: hell, they already have. If the choice is for every country to have a few great carpenters and be proud of them or for coastal American cities to take all the carpenters from everywhere else, I choose the former all the way. (Perhaps there's a more applicable profession, but carpenters came to my head first :P )
I gotta say though: I enjoy being in the writer's tribe. A lot of interesting people for sure! Even so, it is a multitude: one of many. And as Whitman wrote, contradiction is fine. Perhaps the mistake all along has been to try and define ourselves through only one element of ourselves. My reading of Steppenwolf saw his journey as a balancing act of this sort.
Anyway, I hope you figure it out.
Felix, you're definitely a-speaking my language with all the Whitman discussion! Yeah, I agree with a lot of that. I think the underlying "tribe" is to accept "multitudes" and "contradictions" - that's the badge of being part of the "writers' tribe," which can extend perfectly well to people who don't explicitly write.
I definitely grew up with an ingrained idea of ever-expanding liberalism gradually obliterating national borders - the vision of the UN. The last few years have definitely jaded me on that perspective (I have a feeling that you had a stronger sense of national identity in growing up). I'm now pretty sure that I don't want to be part of some supra-national system that slashes prices and wages everywhere it goes, that imposes things like arbitrary lockdowns, and then oh-so-gently quells all critique of itself. The last few years have made me much more appreciative for 'nationalism' of the 19th century liberal variety, with emphasis on difference, self-determination, the ability of many different cultures and vantage-points to flourish all at once. - Sam
Sam, I suspect our age is similar and wile the details differ, I feel your sense of untethered dislocation. Unlike Felix, I left religion after college and haven’t looked back. I dig spirituality and ancient texts but I get your discomfort with the more woo aspects, and after having been devout, I’m in no rush commit too deeply to any particular creed or practice. And I totally grok the myriad of the characters you’ve met in your journey. As I enter the back half of my career, I find that identifying with my profession thin gruel with an impending expiration date. And then pandemic (especially given my wife’s hyper cautiousness) has killed any chance of developing bonds with parents in my kids cohorts.
I always assumed it was just a matter of being a child of immigrants and marrying an immigrant, but now I wonder if it’s also a function of coming of age in the late 90’s during an era of American hegemony, albeit tarnished with our overtly imperialistic peccadillos in the 00’s.
Hey Justus, a lot to think about in what you're writing. I like the verb "grok" btw! - haven't heard that before. Yeah, "identifying with a profession" has been a challenging idea in my life. I'm not sure that the "adversarial system" of the American professional-managerial class works for me - the idea that you identify strongly with your company, or your brand or whatever, and then dedicate your career to a sort of mock-warfare with competitors who are in the same line of work as you. I get why it's an effective system but it just doesn't exactly work for me for some different psychological reasons. I'd be curious to hear more about how you think your perspective was shaped by America in the '90s. Thinking about it in those terms, I think that for me that era created a sense of utopianism - that we had solved some of the underlying problems of societal violence, political organization, and economic stability and that that would give us the platform to build the society of our dreams - and there's been an acute disillusionment that that hasn't exactly materialized. I don't know if there was any real basis to that idealism - it may have just been that our happy memories of childhood coincided with an unusually optimistic period, with the millennium approaching and with an interregnum in great-power rivalries - but I do think there was something poignant in that worldview (and it definitely sets us apart from the Gen Zs who see doom everywhere they go). Anyway, all interesting things to think about!
I was a conservative in the 90's (before become liberal in the 00's after watching Bush screw up Iraq and Katrina) so I've been haunted with a sense of national decline my entire adult life....but even so, coming of age as a middle-class citizen in a unipolar empire must affect one's view of the world. I don't think I fully bought into the Reagan optimism, but still, there's a reason I fell hard for Obama (and felt Tim Scott pulling those heart strings too...too bad he doesn't have the cojones to take on Trump directly).
We also got to see the rise of information technology first hand. From four clunky Apple IIe's in first grade (learning to type on laminated sheets of papers) to having computers in our pockets by the time we finished grad school. If that doesn't breed technological optimism, I dunno what would. Of course the 00's and '10s turned out to be an algorithmically fueled social media tragedy.....
Unlike Z's, my big difference in my outlook of the world is knowing that all the alternatives sucks harder. It's one thing to read about Communist atrocities, it's a whole other thing to go with kids whose parents escaped Vietnam (and my grandmother from a relatively wealthy family got out from Mao's china by the skin of her teeth with her four kids).
The current appeal of Maoism on the left and Fascism on the right completely mystifies me – yeah I'd love to have my opinions enacted on the rest of the nation...but the costs are too damn high. Of course, the older folks that watch Fox all day should know better (at least the Z's have the excuse of youth)...but goes to show that propaganda f'ing works.
“Deep down, what are people? Well, people are social animals. People are community-bound. People are….tribal.”
Yup.
I'll add this here b/c as a fellow tribe member we might as well spread the tribal conversation to both corners:
Thoughtful as always. I’ve been using the term “tribe” for years to speak of my community that exists across so many different boarders. Most of them are creatively driven, even if that means they have a day job, i.e. almost always. But more recently, as I enter my mid 30s, I’ve noticed the disparity between what I’ve come to see as a more traditional/American form of ambition that’s usually related to material wealth and/or public recognition (which is really just another word for high school grade popularity), and people, my tribe, who are more interested in figuring out how to feel fulfilled without any external validation. Thanks for inspiring these many thoughts.
Thank you Samuél! That's all a really nice way to put it. One way I've been thinking about this is that the entire time I was in middle school/high school, I was waiting for people to 'grow up' - for some standard of worth to exist that wasn't the equivalent of high school popularity - and it's been a real disappointment in my life that adulthood doesn't provide that. I don't think it's that it doesn't exist; just that the way our culture is arrayed we're in a sort of eternal high school. So, yes, it's really nice to be part of a tribe - even if an outnumbered and frequently-demoralized tribe! - that just feels there needs to be some other standard of worth; some journey towards a real maturity. Happy to be part of that tribe with you! - Sam